Need a Keeper? Look to Germany

[Sumudica by Night]

Any club in need of a goalkeeper should look to Germany and the Bundesliga

Germany has always produced great keepers but the current crop is exceptional. Manuel Neuer is a world champion, their Under-21 keeper has just won the Champions League with Barcelona and 14 Bundesliga clubs have native No1s

 

 

When Hugo Lloris injured his wrist earlier this month he did more than delay his own start to the season – he threw a spanner into the works of the goalkeeper merry-go-round. If reports were true, the France and Tottenham player had been lined up by Louis van Gaal to replace Real Madrid-bound David de Gea, with Victor Valdés seemingly on his way out of Manchester United.

 

Lloris’ fractured wrist could keep him in London and De Gea in Manchester – at least for this summer. Van Gaal has picked up Sergio Romero on a free transfer, but it remains to be seen whether the Argentina international will be a replacement, competition or back-up for De Gea.

 

Finding a good goalkeeper is never easy; just look at the problems Manchester United faced between Peter Schmeichel’s exit and Edwin van der Saar’s arrival from Fulham. Arsenal have recently profited from Chelsea’s enviable position of having two world-class stoppers, but such an embarrassment of goalkeeping riches is rare.

 

If De Gea returns to Madrid – either this summer or next – United, and the other clubs affected by the move, should look to Germany, because the pickings appear to be very rich indeed. The World Cup and the Champions League were both won by teams with German goalkeepers – OK, one of the teams was Germany – but having two goalkeepers able to play at that level would be a dream for most national managers.

 

The two player in question, Manuel Neuer and Marc-André ter Stegen weren’t just in the teams that won the two most sought-after trophies in world football – but they were influential in the success. Ter Stegen may have only been Barcelona’s cup goalkeeper under Luis Enrique, but he still played over 20 games, winning both cups he played in. And while Neuer’s status as one of Europe’s top keepers is unquestioned, Ter Stegen is just one of many Bundesliga-bred keepers with the potential to challenge Bayern Munich’s keeper for the national jersey.

 

On the back of a treble with Barcelona, Ter Stegen was in action for Germany at the Under-21 World Cup in the Czech Republic. In Germany the Under-21 team is seen as the finishing school for the main team. Nobody expects to graduate straight to a first-team place for the obvious reason that there is no age limit for the national side. The older players don’t have to make way as soon as the latest crop turn 22. And among these players looking for caps in the youth setups, there are a number of very good goalkeepers.

 

Advertisement

 

Ter Stegen is currently not featured in the main squad, where the goalkeepers are Neuer, Roman Weidenfeller of Borussia Dortmund and Ron-Robert Zieler from Hannover 96 (and formerly of Manchester United). Ter Stegen’s status – or lack thereof – in the national setup shows the enviable quality Joachim Löw has to choose from. Do we even know who England’s fourth choice goalkeeper is?

 

Germany has always been a nation of great goalkeepers. You could draw an almost unbroken timeline of great German keepers in the post-war period. Funnily enough, you would probably have to start in England, with Bert Trautmann, the prisoner-of-war turned Manchester City legend. Despite the initial discontent of some fans at the idea of signing a German ex-serviceman with the war still very fresh in the memory, Trautmann soon won them over, playing more than 500 games over 15 years.

 

Despite being mostly remembered for playing on with a broken neck in the 1956 FA Cup final, Trautmann was also an early example of a forward-thinking keeper who looked to start attacks with accurate throws – often to the wide players – as opposed to the general practice of kicking the ball as high and far as possible. One thing that sets him apart from other great German keepers – aside from adopting England as his home – is his lack of international caps. Trautmann never played for his country, a consequence of logistics and politics rather than sporting acumen.

 

Arguably Germany’s greatest national keeper, and the one with the most caps, is Sepp Maier. Die katze von Anzing (the cat from Anzing) played almost 700 games for Bayern Munich and won 94 caps for Germany, winning the European Championship in 1972 and the World Cup in 1974. Maier’s place in the Germany goal was passed on to Harold “Toni” Schumacher, who wore the No1 jersey until the mid-1980s, winning 76 caps and finishing runner-up in the World Cups of 1982 and 1986.

 

As is the case with every institutionalised No1, Schumacher was a club legend at FC Köln, where he later worked as a coach. As Schumacher was coming to the end of his career at FC Köln, a young 18-year-old was waiting in the wings. In a match against Bayern Munich in February 1986, Schumacher gave away a penalty in the 75th minute and was sent off. In his place came Bodo Illgner. Despite impressing, the young keeper still had to bide his time in trying to unseat the incumbent.

 

Schumacher did him a favour by publishing his controversial book Anpfiff (Kick-off), which makes Roy Keane’s literary efforts look more like a summery Enid Blyton jaunt. The book rubbed a lot of people up the wrong way and Schumacher was suspended by both club and country, paving the way for Illgner to become the new No1 at Köln and the national team, where he played over 50 times.

 

Illgner saved Stuart Pearce’s penalty and watched Chris Waddle’s sail into the Turin sky at Italia 90. Illgner followed in Schumacher’s footsteps at club level, keeping goal for the best part of a decade before moving on to Real Madrid, where he won two league titles and two European Cups, making him the most successful German to date to have played at the Bernabéu. Illgner suffered a similar fate to Schumacher, losing his place to a talented young keeper – Iker Casillas.

 

Despite success at club level, and despite winning 54 caps for his country, Illgner retired from international football at the age of 27 on the back of criticism following Germany’s exit from USA 94. Andreas Köpke took over the shirt and kept goal in Germany’s triumphant Euro 96 team, where, again, there were some penalty saves against England involved. Köpke won 59 caps and remained the No1 until Germany were knocked out of the France 98 World Cup by Croatia. Waiting in the wings this time was Oliver Kahn.

 

Having been third choice at USA 94 and No2 at France 98, Kahn had paid his dues. Kahn took the captaincy in 2002 in time for the World Cup in Japan and South Korea but didn’t get his hands on the trophy after his team lost to Brazil in the final. Nevertheless, with eight league titles, multiple cups and a Champions League medal with Bayern Munich, Kahn is one of the most decorated keepers to have played the game, and was voted Uefa goalkeeper of the year four times consecutively from 1999 to 2002, and world goalkeeper of the year in 1999, 2001 and 2002.

 

Every keeper’s time comes to an end, or at least comes under threat. In Kahn’s case, the threat came from Jens Lehmann – and to a certain extent from Jürgen Klinsmann. After taking over from Rudi Völler in 2004, Klinsmann chose not to have a clear-cut No1 and instead fostered the rivalry between Kahn and Lehmann, encouraging them to fight for the shirt. Lehmann was given the nod at the 2006 World Cup in Germany in 2006. Kahn played in the third-place play-off against Portugal, but it was to be his last match for Germany – after 86 caps, with 49 as captain, he retired from international football.

 

Lehmann followed two years later after Germany’s defeat to Spain in the Euro 2008 final, saying that he wanted to clear the path for a younger keeper to be installed for South Africa and beyond. The keeper many had in mind was René Adler, then of Bayer Leverkusen. Other candidates included the late Robert Enke and Tim Wiese. After Enke’s tragic death, Wiese’s inconsistent form and Adler’s injury, Germany suddenly had something of a goalkeeping crisis. Enter Manuel Neuer.

 

He stepped up to No1 shortly before the 2010 World Cup and has been ever-present in the team since, largely without major competition. Löw, who was assistant to Klinsmann before taking the hot seat, doesn’t seem to share his predecessor’s penchant for rotating the goalkeeper.

 

If the country’s uninterrupted history of great keepers is not proof enough that Germany is a haven for shot stoppers, then take a look at the Bundesliga. Of the 18 clubs that finished in the league last season 14 had German goalkeepers as their No1.

 

Even more encouraging for Löw, and even his successor, is that the majority of them are relatively young – prime examples including Bernd Leno at Leverkusen, Timo Horn at FC Köln, and Lorius Karius at Borussia Dortmund (having just signed from Mainz 05). Alongside these youngsters – and the incumbent reserve goalkeepers, Weidenfeller and Zieler – are talented keepers such as Oliver Baumann at Hoffenheim, Thomas Kraft at Hertha Berlin, Sven Ulreich at Bayern Munich (recently of VfB Stuttgart) and Kevin Trapp, who has just signed for PSG.

 

Compare this with the situation in England. Of the 20 clubs that finished the Premier League this season, only six had an English No1. England’s stable of top-flight goalkeepers consisted of Joe Hart at Manchester City, Fraser Forster at Southampton, Ben Foster at West Brom, Steve Harper at Hull City, Tom Heaton at Burnley and Rob Green at QPR. Six from 20 is not a great quota, especially when the last three were all relegated.

 

The goalkeeping future for Germany is bright. But where does Marc-Andre ter Stegen fit into things? He could kick on at Barcelona, establishing himself as the undisputed No1 for Luis Enrique’s team, and go on to win multiple honours, even becoming one of the game’s most decorated keepers. Where would this leave him in terms of the national set up? As good as Ter Stegen has been for Barcelona in the cup competitions, and despite the form at Borussia Mönchengladbach that earned him the move to the Nou Camp, his international career has suffered a stuttering start, having won only four senior caps, in which he didn’t really cover himself in glory. Still, he is only 23 and mistakes are to be expected. His year in Spain, playing in a winning team and tasting glory will have done him good. If keepers really do peak nearer the age of 30, then he is well ahead of schedule.

 

As it good as he is, or may be, Ter Stegen isn’t the first, or probably anywhere near the best, goalkeeper who’s played for a top team but can’t get into the national team. For contemporary examples, look no further than Victor Valdes, Pepe Reina or David de Gea for Spain. Ter Stegen has the formidable figure of Manuel Neuer blocking his path to the No1 shirt – the first goalkeeper to be nominated for the Ballon D’or since Gianluigi Buffon in 2006, and the first German in the final three since Oliver Kahn in 2002. Barring serious injury or a prolonged loss of form, Neuer looks set to be Germany’s No1 for the foreseeable future – at least until Euro 2020, by which time he’ll be 34.

 

But football is not that simple. After all, Neuer was only given the nod for the national team in 2010 thanks to an injury to Adler. It is feasible, however, that Ter Stegen will rack up trophies with Barça but be limited to friendlies and dead rubbers with the national team; it’s bad for him, but is a real sign of power for his country.

 

The Guardian

[depina]

Bartolo :heart: :prayer:

[Coiso]

O tópico do Bartolo :prayer:

[Rafinha]

Lorius Karius at Borussia Dortmund (having just signed from Mainz 05)

 

:mrgreen:

 

 

E incrível como o Fahrmann nunca é falado quando se faz referência à qualidade dos GRs Alemães. É tão underrated.

[BartoloSerenity]

Fds Guardian :prayer: :prayer: :prayer: :prayer: :prayer:

Fazem tudo bem, desde a formação, aos estatutos a literalmente a mais pequena coisa. E a Suíça está a ir pelo mesmo caminho.

Rafinha, também eu estranhei com a omissão do Fahrmann, afinal de contas ele está acima do Karius, Horn e até mesmo do Ter Stegen em termos de estatuto para ser escolhido.

Vai ter de ser outro que só quando sair da Alemanha é que lhe vão dar valor.

Essa do Karius no Dortmund até me fez procurar isso por toda a net :lol:

[Red Prince]

Grande coisa, com balizas daquele tamanho também eu era guarda-redes.

[Kratosthegod]

Lorius Karius at Borussia Dortmund (having just signed from Mainz 05)

 

:mrgreen:

 

 

E incrível como o Fahrmann nunca é falado quando se faz referência à qualidade dos GRs Alemães. É tão underrated.

 

Pode ser underrated mas não é melhor que o Karius ou Horn 8)

 

O Zieler e o Leno também deviam dar o salto. O Leno acho que tem tudo para ser o número 1 de uma equipa top: Man Utd, Real , seja quem for.

[Simeone]

A escola italiana também não é nada má

[FabioK]

A escola italiana também não é nada má

Em tempos foi a melhor. Mas de momento quem é que tens a despontar assim com um Leno, um Karius, um Ter Stegen ? Ninguém....tens alguns nomes que com alguma sorte podem dar bons grs de 1º liga, Bardi, Leali....a minha maior esperança era o Scuffet e parece que agora já nem conta na Udinese.

[Kratosthegod]

Faltou o melhor deles todos, Perin :prayer:

[johan]

Em tempos foi a melhor. Mas de momento quem é que tens a despontar assim com um Leno, um Karius, um Ter Stegen ? Ninguém....tens alguns nomes que com alguma sorte podem dar bons grs de 1º liga, Bardi, Leali....a minha maior esperança era o Scuffet e parece que agora já nem conta na Udinese.

 

Sportiello, Sepe, Cragno, Alex Meret (fala-se que tem mais potencial que o Scuffet), agora o que apareceu no Milan e que pelos vistos agrada ao Miha. Há bastantes.

[Simeone]

Em tempos foi a melhor. Mas de momento quem é que tens a despontar assim com um Leno, um Karius, um Ter Stegen ? Ninguém....tens alguns nomes que com alguma sorte podem dar bons grs de 1º liga, Bardi, Leali....a minha maior esperança era o Scuffet e parece que agora já nem conta na Udinese.

Não formam estrelas (atualmente) mas tens muitos e bons guarda-redes italianos. Bardi, Leali, Perin, Sportiello e outros com créditos firmados como Sirigu, Marchetti, Buffon (jovem promessa :mrgreen: ) ou até Viviano. O escola italiana, apesar de já não ser a melhor, é muito boa ainda.

[BartoloSerenity]

Sportiello, Sepe, Cragno, Alex Meret (fala-se que tem mais potencial que o Scuffet), agora o que apareceu no Milan e que pelos vistos agrada ao Miha. Há bastantes.

Agora diz lá valores seguros como Ter Stegen, Horn, Karius e Leno...

E então nas promessas tens Shcnitzler, Gersbeck, Schwabe, Wellenreuther e outros mais.

Não estou a dizer que na Itália não existem também uns quantos, mas com a qualidade destes que referi salvo o Scuffett se aprender o que ainda tem para aprender não há mais nenhum a não ser o Perin e talvez o Sepe.

[Oblivion]

Faltou o melhor deles todos, Perin :prayer:

sabes tanto :heart: vai ser a maior venda da história do Génova

[BartoloSerenity]

sabes tanto :heart: vai ser a maior venda da história do Génova

Não me parece, mas se há sitio onde por norma o valor dos GR é inflacionado é na Itália...

[Oblivion]

Não me parece, mas se há sitio onde por norma o valor dos GR é inflacionado é na Itália...

Agora que penso bem, não sei se bate os 25M€ do Milito, mas espero que chegue lá perto.

[Flamez]

Não me parece, mas se há sitio onde por norma o valor dos GR é inflacionado é na Itália...

O que te leva a dizer isso? Espero que não seja pelo preço do Buffon. :lol:

[Visitante]

O Genova é um dos meus clubes favoritos em Itália não sei porquê. Vejo alguns jogos deles e tal, mas aquilo é um corrupio de jogadores todos os anos, não ganham nada nos últimos anos, não têm nenhuma referência maior do clube (o Perin não conta, é puto ainda), nada... e mesmo assim curto o clube. Acho que é do Grifo :mrgreen:

[Oblivion]

O Genova é um dos meus clubes favoritos em Itália não sei porquê. Vejo alguns jogos deles e tal, mas aquilo é um corrupio de jogadores todos os anos, não ganham nada nos últimos anos, não têm nenhuma referência maior do clube (o Perin não conta, é puto ainda), nada... e mesmo assim curto o clube. Acho que é do Grifo :mrgreen:

O que há para não gostar? :D

 

É um clube com história, apesar de tudo. Eu apaixonei-me desde que estive lá há 13 anos. O Luigi Ferraris tem um ambiente brutal :heart:

[Visitante]

O que há para não gostar? :D

 

É um clube com história, apesar de tudo. Eu apaixonei-me desde que estive lá há 13 anos. O Luigi Ferraris tem um ambiente brutal :heart:

 

Sim, tem imensa história, apesar de tudo. E está na cidade mais linda de Itália na minha opinião :heart:

Mas acho que é pessimamente gerido, como muitos dos clubes em Itália. Por isso dá-me um gostinho especial ter sucesso com eles no FM :biggrin:

[BartoloSerenity]

O que te leva a dizer isso? Espero que não seja pelo preço do Buffon. :lol:

A Udinese pediu 18 milhões pelo Scuffet ao Atlético e os burros foram de encontro a esse valor...

Esse valor do Buffon foi uma excepção, além do De Gea e talvez do Lloris e do Oblak (estão em clubes de 2ª linha, peço desculpa mas é assim que vejo) mais ninguém se vai aproximar desse valor.

[Flamez]

A Udinese pediu 18 milhões pelo Scuffet ao Atlético e os burros foram de encontro a esse valor...

Esse valor do Buffon foi uma excepção, além do De Gea e talvez do Lloris e do Oblak (estão em clubes de 2ª linha, peço desculpa mas é assim que vejo) mais ninguém se vai aproximar desse valor.

Ou seja, não há norma nenhuma de inflação? Para o teu único exemplo ser o duma não transferência... :mrgreen:

 

Eu achei estranho o comentário porque as últimas gerações nem sequer têm dado azo a que haja grande hype para serem valorizados acima do que valem.

[FabioK]

Sportiello, Sepe, Cragno, Alex Meret (fala-se que tem mais potencial que o Scuffet), agora o que apareceu no Milan e que pelos vistos agrada ao Miha. Há bastantes.

 

 

Não formam estrelas (atualmente) mas tens muitos e bons guarda-redes italianos. Bardi, Leali, Perin, Sportiello e outros com créditos firmados como Sirigu, Marchetti, Buffon (jovem promessa :mrgreen: ) ou até Viviano. O escola italiana, apesar de já não ser a melhor, é muito boa ainda.

 

Lá está, vai um pouco de encontro ao que disse ,há 5 ou 6 que são jovens com algum potencial, na Alemanha há 5 ou 6 certezas... é diferente.

[Kratosthegod]

1 - Buffon

3 - Toldo

6 e 7 - Peruzzi

 

Do top 10 de transferências de GR's, 4 foram italianos, sendo que as 4 transferências foram no início da época passada onde os valores de transferências ainad eram normais. O Frey também entra 2x no top 10 já agora :mrgreen:

 

Se calhar é por isto.

[Flamez]

Só se for pelo Frey, nesse caso

 

Todos eles foram negócios feitos um pouco sobre o efeito dominó, até mesmo o Buffon (Zidane), mas sinceramente não acho que nenhum dos 3 seja peixe fora de água nessa lista.